Challenge: Rivals - Cry For Me, Argentina

[QUOTE=jace89;269548]Not the same thing bro. Ct disrespected adam's manhood by pouring a beer on his head. Ct punked him on national tv because he knew adam wouldn't do anything back. I bet Adam's friends got on him for that.[/QUOTE] Dude, Wes did basically the same thing (except he poured like 50x much more) to a CHICK. Tell me that's not worse than CT dumping maybe 4 or 5 ounces of beer on Adam's head. You pour a beer on a guy's head and any dude with a backbone is going to stand up for himself. There's a chance the guy is going to do something back to you. You pour something on a chick's head and 99% of them are just going to cry and not do anything, especially one like Cara Maria. And you're on junk too if you think Wes is running this game. Kenny's expansive connections are what's helping them in this game. Look at how far mastermind Wes made it on his last two challenges when he had to whip together chicken salad out of chicken **** for his alliances.

[QUOTE=jace89;269526]How was she disrespectful to CM? You can't say it was for no reason when clearly NOTHING WAS SHOWN!! The only thing we saw was a empty bottle and CM wet.[/QUOTE] Going into the season I was a Paula fan, and I still am rooting for her, but sometimes the way she acts can make it so hard to defend her! How was she disrespectful to CM? When CM was mad at Wes for pouring stuff all over her and trying to defend herself Paula came over (due to her 'loyalty' to Wes) and backed up Wes by laughing and giving him a high-five. Yes I'd consider that rude and disrespectful to laugh at someone [B]who is hurt[/B] by the fact that she got soda poured on her white shirt for no reason. And she said mean things to CM too, laughing she said you look wet and stupid. Seemed to me like Paula was suggesting CM just should be quiet and stop arguing for Wes being a jerk and messing with her. Point is Paula didn't even need to get involved, and 'defending' Wes, for what Paula? IMO the only right way to defend him would have been to say CM it was just a joke he didn't mean anything more than that. But she didn't say that, she said things to put CM down even more and she was wrong for that. She wasn't defending Wes she was helping him pick on CM further.

[QUOTE=townie;269544] The thing that sucks for Adam is that people like[B] Johnny and Kenny are very narcissistic and don't really look at good qualities in people when they chose who they surround themselves with[/B]. They want people around them who think they're the **** and who will make them feel good about themselves and pump their egos up for them. [/QUOTE] I would be interested to know what you know about Johnny and Kenny and who they surround themselves with. On the show, 98% of the cast surrounds them. Outside of the show, I would assume you don't know what you're talking about.

[QUOTE=jace89;269548]Not the same thing bro. Ct disrespected adam's manhood by pouring a beer on his head. Ct punked him on national tv because he knew adam wouldn't do anything back. I bet Adam's friends got on him for that.[/QUOTE] I'm sorry, but you are just grasping at straws here. Adam and Cara Maria's situations were barely any different from each other. The fact that Adam is male does not somehow magically negate that.

[QUOTE=JL81790;269550]The only intelligent political move that Wes has EVER made was the Evan thing on the Duel 1. Kenny and Johnny were nonfactors on that challenge and Wes had no hand in their eliminations. Regardless, that's irrelevant. On this challenge, if we switch it to Kenny/Adam and Wes/Ct the mob still has majority. The only teams that they would have on their side at BEST are Davis/Tyrie, Robin/Aneesa, Jasmine/Jonna, Mike/Leroy, and Brandon/Ty which, if we look at how the show has gone, represent the weakest teams in each gender (aside form Mike/Leroy), so, just like on FM2, WES'S people would be picked off one by one. It's strange how you don't see that the only reason that Wes has some semblance of control is because of his partner. If he didn't have Kenny (and Kenny's friends by entailment) backing him up, he would be in the same position he was in on the Ruins.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Nightwolf;269552]There's a difference between Wes's actions and everyone else's. If you're alone with Wes and he goes up to you and says "Hey no one likes you" and the situation ends there, it just ends with Wes being a ****. If you're in a house with 13 other people and Wes goes up to you and says "Hey, no one likes you" and only one of those 13 people say "Hey, I do like you," how would you expect to feel? It's not the words, it's the fact that people were actually defending his unprovoked actions.[/QUOTE] Saying "no one likes you" is the most light insult I have seen on this show. Damn, I don't understand the big deal with that. So CM is liked everywhere she goes now? FM2 was determined the moment Kenny got Laurel and Wes got Mandi. If Mandi was on Kenny's team, he would have gone home the first night.

My opinion on the challenge: Unfair to CT and Adam but we all seem to share an opinion on that. My opinion on Paula vs Laurel: Paula may have started it with the barrage of attacks on Cara Maria but Laurel made an idiot out of herself. This whole eye for an eye mentality that many Vevmo posters have is ridiculous. If someone does something to me I will definitely get them back but not to the extent Laurel did to Paula. I'm not sticking up for Paula, I think what she did was wrong and it should stop but what Laurel did was wrong too. Both are wrong, but need to shut up and stop their moronic behavior. My opinion on Cara Maria: I feel that she is either too sensitive for this show or she is acting this way on purpose. I really don't know but I think evidence leans more towards her just being sensitive. My opinion on Wes: CT hit the nail on the head when he told Cara Maria that he is a little punk and would never do that in real life. Seriously, who dumps all that soda on someone else, let alone, a girl? Wes acts like such a tough guy because he knows no one will hit him. He did that to Cara Maria because he knew that whatever she did, it wouldn't hurt him. He admitted on the after show that had CT hit him, he'd curl up and pretend to be knocked out. He does what everyone says CT does, goes after the "smaller guy". When I say smaller guy, I don't mean someone being physically smaller but someone who wouldn't do anything back. Wes is an idiot. He could be the size of a pea and still think that he is the best competitor there. Also, pouring a beer on a man's head is not worse than pouring soda on a woman's head. You say CT knew Adam wouldn't do anything but Wes knew Cara Maria wouldn't do anything. So are you going to tell me punching a guy in the face is worse than punching a girl in the face? Wes has proven time and time again that his a huge hypocrite. Telling people to act like good human beings but here he is, finally in the in crowd, picking on someone who isn't. Pouring soda on a woman. Doing basically what he hated. The fact that I wanted to crawl inside my tv and tackle Wes, says a lot. (I felt the same way when I saw Johnny and Tyler picking on Mike)

[QUOTE=jace89;269548]Not the same thing bro. Ct disrespected adam's manhood by pouring a beer on his head. Ct punked him on national tv because he knew adam wouldn't do anything back. I bet Adam's friends got on him for that.[/QUOTE] How is it not the same thing??? It is not a cool thing to do to someone, especially the way both Wes and C.T. did them. CM and Adam were not good friends with them so even if it was a joke that isn't something you do to someone unless you know they would be cool with it because you two are buds. It's not the same because Adam is a man?? Is that it? Please explain what you mean because what you said sound ridiculous.

[QUOTE=cystic;269558]I'm sorry, but you are just grasping at straws here. Adam and Cara Maria's situations were barely any different from each other. The fact that Adam is male does not somehow magically negate that.[/QUOTE] I'm not. Adam even said he never got over that and it was almost 5 years later. OMG the way CT just stood there poured it face to face made it worse than this.

[QUOTE=JL81790;269550] It's strange how you don't see that the only reason that Wes has some semblance of control is because of his partner. If he didn't have Kenny (and Kenny's friends by entailment) backing him up, he would be in the same position he was in on the Ruins.[/QUOTE] I absolutely agree with you on everything in this post. Which is really wierd for me since up until The Ruins, I liked Wes and his "somewhat rational" self. Here on Rivals, he basically annoyed the hell out of me. Its like "get real" already.

[QUOTE=DomDom7;269562]How is it not the same thing??? It is not a cool thing to do to someone, especially the way both Wes and C.T. did them. CM and Adam were not good friends with them so even if it was a joke that isn't something you do to someone unless you know they would be cool with it because you two are buds. It's not the same because Adam is a man?? Is that it? Please explain what you mean because what you said sounds ridiculous.[/QUOTE] OKAY, let someone pour a beer on CT and see what happens next. Oh that's right, Adam poured a beer on CT and got punched.

[QUOTE=Blamo;269476]Laurel's primary target for her anger was Wes, who she was chasing around with a bottle of cola trying to "get him back." The only reason she went after Paula with such a monstrous overkill of force was because she was enraged by how Wes, Tyler and Johnny mocked and dismissed her anger. [/QUOTE] No, actually she went after Paula because Paula kept trying to chime in when Laurel was chasing Wes and yelling at him. She told Paula to stay out of it, but she kept on talking and Laurel got her to shut up. Yes Laurel went too far but Paula had something coming for her part in it all.

[QUOTE=jace89;269567]OKAY, let someone pour a beer on CT and see what happens next. He even tried to do it again before the fight.[/QUOTE] OKAY, if someone did that to CT, he'd stand up for himself. It's not his fault Adam just stood there. Should guys go around pouring **** all over girls and we just watch and laugh? What next? Should guys go around and start degrading woman and we just sit around and laugh? Should we say it's okay because it's to a woman but it would be worse if it was to another man. What, are we stuck in the past where woman have no rights or something? I know, next, we should not let them work or vote anymore. This whole "it's okay cause it happened to a woman" mentality you got going on screams immaturity.

Adam didn't get punched because he poured a beer on CT's head, he got punched because he hit him in the face with a beer can.

[QUOTE=townie;269571]Adam didn't get punched because he poured a beer on CT's head, he got punched because he hit him in the face with a beer can.[/QUOTE] The way Adam's arms were positioned say otherwise. Can I post gifs here?

[QUOTE=producer88;269512]When you have 5 people arguing with you, and you're trying to defend your friend, you're going to attack whoever instigates, or shouldn't be in the situation in the first place. Paula should have minded her own business, and she should have separated herself from the situation. Laurel was after Wes, people started to nag Laurel, and Paula decided to jump on the bandwagon. If Laurel tells you to shut the **** up, than shut the **** up, because the issue doesn't concern you. Personally, there's nothing more irritating when someone who doesn't need to get involve, does. Laurel will tell you how she feels, and she's not going to sugarcoat it. Also messing with CM, who is her partner, is messing with Laurel's money. That could break CM down completely, and make her lose confidence. Another reason I agree with Laurel "**** with my money, and I'm coming after you." By Twitter comments it seems a lot of people agree with the way Laurel handle the situation. Don't push somebody, and expect nothing to happen. Bullying CM was probably going on for days.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=producer88;269536]By her tweets seems like Paula is getting attacked on Twitter. The majority of people agree with what Laurel did...as much as I like Paula, she deserved it.[/QUOTE] If someone jumps into a conversation that doesn't necessarily need to, like Paula, the first thing you do is not tell them to shut the **** up and call them names. Yes, alcohol was probably involved and that intensified the situation, but the names Laurel was spitting out of her mouth had nothing to do with the situation at hand. That is why I seriously don't think Paula [I]deserved[/I] any of the name calling. Sure she deserved to be yelled at, but it's appalling to me that people are automatically jumping on the Laurel bandwagon because someone deserved to be yelled at. And it's also ridiculous that people find the need to attack someone over social media from a stupid situation on a reality television show.

I haven't even seen this episode and based on most of these comments, will not be watching it. The actions taken by these people in their mid to late 20s and even 30s is disgusting, immature and pathetic. The fact that some people find their actions to be warranted and hilarious is just as bad. The insecurities are blaringly obvious from all parties. You do not pour soda on someone's head. If you do that "in real life" at a bar, chances are a guy would want to fight you. You do not "take what you know" about someone and use it in an argument as leverage. I think most of these people have forgotten what "being the bigger person" is all about. I understand some of these people are doing what they are doing for television purposes and that they "aren't really like that in real life", but personal attacks are just going too far. A person does not "deserve" to be verbally attacked. They do not "deserve" physical harm or humiliation. And you, as a viewer, do not "hate" them. Some people may watch these challenges for the drama, but in my opinion, that's what the Real World is for. I like to watch the challenges for the competition. The editing has gone so far south (focusing 10% on competition and 90% on petty bull****) that I simply have no desire to watch anymore.

[QUOTE=jace89;269572]The way Adam's arms were positioned say otherwise. Can I post gifs here?[/QUOTE] If it has nothing to do with the episode Rivals - Cry For Me, Argentina, then no.

Let's stay on topic folks. Mentioning Adam/CT is fine.. but clogging up the thread with a long debate solely about it, is not. Move along happy posters... :)

[QUOTE=jace89;269567]OKAY, let someone pour a beer on CT and see what happens next. Oh that's right, Adam poured a beer on CT and got punched.[/QUOTE] You didn't answer my question though, how is what C.T. did different than what Wes did to Cara Maria?? They both got liquid poured on them that they didn't want or deserve. You really didn't acknowledge anything I said. How can you say what Wes did to CM is not the same as what C.T. did to Adam? In both instances they were affected badly. CM was obviously very upset about what happened and what was said to her. You make it seem like since one was to a man and one to a woman it makes a difference, I tried to give you a chance to say that isn't what you meant but you totally ignored that opportunity and said what I quoted above. [QUOTE=faceless;269570]Should guys go around pouring **** all over girls and we just watch and laugh? What next? Should guys go around and start degrading woman and we just sit around and laugh? Should we say it's okay because it's to a woman but it would be worse if it was to another man. What, are we stuck in the past where woman have no rights or something? I know, next, we should not let them work or vote anymore. This whole "it's okay cause it happened to a woman" mentality you got going on screams immaturity.[/QUOTE] Agree 100% with this point.

[QUOTE=molds13;269574]I haven't even seen this episode and based on most of these comments, will not be watching it. The actions taken by these people in their mid to late 20s and even 30s is disgusting, immature and pathetic. The fact that some people find their actions to be warranted and hilarious is just as bad. The insecurities are blaringly obvious from all parties. You do not pour soda on someone's head. If you do that "in real life" at a bar, chances are a guy would want to fight you. You do not "take what you know" about someone and use it in an argument as leverage. I think most of these people have forgotten what "being the bigger person" is all about. I understand some of these people are doing what they are doing for television purposes and that they "aren't really like that in real life", but personal attacks are just going too far. A person does not "deserve" to be verbally attacked. They do not "deserve" physical harm or humiliation. And you, as a viewer, do not "hate" them. Some people may watch these challenges for the drama, but in my opinion, that's what the Real World is for. I like to watch the challenges for the competition. The editing has gone so far south (focusing 10% on competition and 90% on petty bull****) that I simply have no desire to watch anymore.[/QUOTE] Seems like drama + competition has been what this show has always been about. When they changed the show to the hour format, it seemed they decided to show more drama. It still doesnt seem there's more drama than usual. It's probably just that people are being more harsh and personal with their comments this season, and there's more crying.

[QUOTE=DomDom7;269568]No, actually she went after Paula because Paula kept trying to chime in when Laurel was chasing Wes and yelling at him. She told Paula to stay out of it, but she kept on talking and Laurel got her to shut up. Yes Laurel went too far but Paula had something coming for her part in it all.[/QUOTE] That is the reason that Laurel spoke to Paula at all, but the reason that Paula became the [i]focus[/i] of all her anger was because she was too weak to hurt Wes, Tyler, or Johnny. You can't tell me that anything Paula said was more provocative than having a bottle of water thrown at her. Why not target target Johnny with her anger? The answer is that Laurel would get clowned in a verbal confrontation with Johnny, and she knows it.

[QUOTE=jace89;269472]Say what you will about Wes, but he's hands down the best political player the challenge has ever seen. Wes used his partner Kenny's alliance to slowly pick off members of JEK and made it seem like he had nothing to do with it. It's quite ironic that CT IS against the same alliance he help create on the Duel 1. People tend to forget CT was in Wes' shoes on the Gauntlet 3.[/QUOTE] How is Wes the best political player? If this was true, then his entire Ruins team wouldn't have been against him like they were. Also, if this was true, then he would've lasted longer on FM2. I agree with the second point. I'm surprised by how much weight he has in the alliance he has on this challenge. He sparked the idea to put thngs in Adam's head about CT, which Johnny and Kenny went through with. Not sure what your last point was about.

[QUOTE=Blamo;269603]That is the reason that Laurel spoke to Paula at all, but the reason that Paula became the [i]focus[/i] of all her anger was because she was too weak to hurt Wes, Tyler, or Johnny. You can't tell me that anything Paula said was more provocative than having a bottle of water thrown at her. Why not target target Johnny with her anger? The answer is that Laurel would get clowned in a verbal confrontation with Johnny, and she knows it.[/QUOTE] You couldn't be more right. Of all the people picking on CM, that is EXACTLY why she chose Paula. She knew she could beat her. That doesn't sound like much of a lioness to me. (even if her ridiculous hair screams jungle creature.)

I have not posted on this board for quite some time, but I must say that I find it absolutely ridiculous that someone thinks what Wes did to Cara wasn't as bad as what CT did to Adam. Male ego has nothing to do with it and should not be a factor in determining what is "worse". As a female that has had beer poured all over me and my car by a large, drunk man, it was very upsetting, and I was extremely rattled. I wasn't as upset as Cara appeared in the show, but I also wasn't being picked on by a group of people for days.

[QUOTE=molds13;269574]Some people may watch these challenges for the drama, but in my opinion, that's what the Real World is for. I like to watch the challenges for the competition. The editing has gone so far south (focusing 10% on competition and 90% on petty bull****) that I simply have no desire to watch anymore.[/QUOTE] I totally agree. From what I saw, everyone involved was in the wrong. The whole pouring-soda-on-Cara-Maria incident, with Paula cheering and then Laurel bringing out the nukes kinda reminds me of a certain Stephen King novel called Carrie. Watching this episode made me feel nauseous. It seems like these shows are less about challenge/athletic competition and more about throwing people into a bad situation, giving them alcohol, cutting them off from civilization, and seeing how long it takes for them to break so they display the basest examples of human behaviour. And all for the benefit of ratings. I think I need to find a sport to follow instead.

[QUOTE=molds13;269574][B]I haven't even seen this episode and based on most of these comments, will not be watching it.[/B] The actions taken by these people in their mid to late 20s and even 30s is disgusting, immature and pathetic. The fact that some people find their actions to be warranted and hilarious is just as bad. The insecurities are blaringly obvious from all parties. You do not pour soda on someone's head. If you do that "in real life" at a bar, chances are a guy would want to fight you. You do not "take what you know" about someone and use it in an argument as leverage. I think most of these people have forgotten what "being the bigger person" is all about. I understand some of these people are doing what they are doing for television purposes and that they "aren't really like that in real life", but personal attacks are just going too far. A person does not "deserve" to be verbally attacked. They do not "deserve" physical harm or humiliation. And you, as a viewer, do not "hate" them. Some people may watch these challenges for the drama, but in my opinion, that's what the Real World is for. I like to watch the challenges for the competition. The editing has gone so far south (focusing 10% on competition and 90% on petty bull****) that I simply have no desire to watch anymore.[/QUOTE] This episode does bring out the uglier side in some of these people. The challenge itself was pretty interesting though. Definitely some controversey about how the producers chose to execute the challenge with certain competitors, but it was a fun challenge. Beyond that though, everyone is simply trying their best to divide people and **** with their heads. It's always the people who are the most desperate, and who have the least confidence who find it so easy to step on others in order to elevate themselves and increase their social proof among the people they try to be friends with. Take the worst parts of high school, turn it up a notch and you get what you see on these challenges. And I am sure several people came out of this episode ashamed for one thing or another.

[QUOTE=Insider;269606]You couldn't be more right. Of all the people picking on CM, that is EXACTLY why she chose Paula. She knew she could beat her. That doesn't sound like much of a lioness to me. (even if her ridiculous hair screams jungle creature.)[/QUOTE] My problem with Laurel is that she has darkness to her soul that seem to think it's OK to hit below the belt. She's a lioness, alright...

I have to admit here that it really seems like the season didn't even start until the last couple of episodes since nothing that big of note happened before them.

[QUOTE=Blamo;269603]That is the reason that Laurel spoke to Paula at all, but the reason that Paula became the [i]focus[/i] of all her anger was because she was too weak to hurt Wes, Tyler, or Johnny. You can't tell me that anything Paula said was more provocative than having a bottle of water thrown at her. Why not target target Johnny with her anger? The answer is that Laurel would get clowned in a verbal confrontation with Johnny, and she knows it.[/QUOTE] You are right, I misinterpreted what you meant. Paula is the only one she had anything negative(that would really hurt) on so she went for her. You can call Johnny a jerk all you want but it seems to go right through him. Same with Wes, just doesn't seem to bother him. I guess what I'm trying to say is that she wouldn't have picked on Paula if Paula had just stayed out of it. The main focus of her anger primarily was towards Wes, and the whole water bottle thing she was like who threw that? And nobody said who it was. I'm not at all saying Laurel had a right to go so low and say such terrible hurtful things, but Paula was going to get something back for her part in the CM thing.

[QUOTE=molds13;269574]I haven't even seen this episode and based on most of these comments, will not be watching it. The actions taken by these people in their mid to late 20s and even 30s is disgusting, immature and pathetic. The fact that some people find their actions to be warranted and hilarious is just as bad. The insecurities are blaringly obvious from all parties. You do not pour soda on someone's head. If you do that "in real life" at a bar, chances are a guy would want to fight you. You do not "take what you know" about someone and use it in an argument as leverage. I think most of these people have forgotten what "being the bigger person" is all about. I understand some of these people are doing what they are doing for television purposes and that they "aren't really like that in real life", but personal attacks are just going too far. A person does not "deserve" to be verbally attacked. They do not "deserve" physical harm or humiliation. And you, as a viewer, do not "hate" them. Some people may watch these challenges for the drama, but in my opinion, that's what the Real World is for. I like to watch the challenges for the competition. The editing has gone so far south (focusing 10% on competition and 90% on petty bull****) that I simply have no desire to watch anymore.[/QUOTE] I usually agree with you, but this time I don't. What Wes, Paula, Jenn, CT, and Tyler have done to Cara Maria is in no way acceptable. They were personally attacking her, Jenn tried to slap her, Tyler slapped off her hat, and Wes poured soda on her head, and she's been screamed at non-stop. I'm sorry but unless you watch it, you have not seen the pain and suffering she was going through and all she could say to Wes was "I hate you" as she started to cry. THAT is emotional abuse, THAT is bullying the innocent, and I haven't seen anyone on the Challenges go that far in a long time, it was even worse than The Island IMO. Did Laurel get too personal? Yes she did. But maybe Paula should think about that before she blindly joins in a bullying frenzy if she is so emotionally fragile. I do not feel sorry for Paula. That being said, I like everyone on the show, mistakes and all, except for maybe Wes just because he's so flawed yet so condescending. And I like the competitive aspects of the Challenges more-so than this drama. It's not the editor's fault if the people are bullying and acting crazy, they just use what will bring ratings.