[QUOTE=Debut Album;388012]Politic Drama can just as fake an boring.[/QUOTE]
Exactly it's all pretty contrived drama for filler space in their 1 hour show. When the show was 30 minutes, it was so much better. Less stupid stuff and certain formats didn't allow so much politicking. Yet those were the best seasons.
The best drama on these shows have come from a competition stand point, not a social bs standpoint.
[QUOTE=Squad;388020]So where are we at in this speculation.[/QUOTE]
All we have are the F5 (maybe F4) from spoilers / others hearing things, but aside from that, nothing.
[QUOTE=kvm1977;387948]Because the social aspect is important to many people
[B]Otherwise just create an NCAA March Madness bracket and let them go had to head[/B]
Those that don't like the social aspect simply hate those that are good at it
If random cards determine who goes in people will stop watching...me and Challenge17 for starters[/QUOTE]
That actually is a good Idea.
And I don't think that people hate others who are good at the social aspect..It's just the same things keep happening and people are tired of it. This show needs a change. It needs a shake up and getting rid of the social game may be just what the doctor ordered.
I say make it happen BMP!
Been following this thread for a while and I figured its about time I posted.
This threads all over the place and from what I can see its down to a legitimate final 5 males for sure and speculated final 5 females.
I've gathered enough to assume any of the following males could be out as speculated earlier in the forum.
CT out by Zach
Johnny out via Twitter like
Leroy/Zach potential elimination was mentioned earlier as well as one of the two may not have made it to final
Also on the males side its been speculated that
Leroy/JohhnyB 1st
CT came 2nd
Zach in 3rd
as well as several other potential finishes.
Is this all pure speculation or do people have legitimate sources to back this all up?
Can anyone help me out here? haha
[QUOTE=Debut Album;388032]That actually is a good Idea.
And I don't think that people hate others who are good at the social aspect..It's just the same things keep happening and people are tired of it. This show needs a change. It needs a shake up and getting rid of the social game may be just what the doctor ordered.
I say make it happen BMP![/QUOTE]
Getting rid of the social game will never happen.
Too many people here on this board look at this show as an athletic competition. While the competition and the athletics are an important aspect, in Bunim & Murray's eyes as well as MTV's, this show is about drama. In their eyes, winning the Challenge is a bonus check for giving B/M and MTV a good season.
Also, they do things every season to swing the show a certain way to cause drama and get people talking. Case in point, the Bananas backpack. The producers knew Johnny would be going in at some point and they saved that elimination just for him. Having CT vs. Derrick or CT vs. Abe was not nearly as good a get as Johnny B vs. CT because of their history and open disdain for each other on the show. If they wanted to play it straight, it should have been Johnny vs. Tyler again and may the best man win. But they didn't go that way because throwing in the CT monkeywrench made for better television.
In a perfect world, The Challenge will be this amazing competition with a lot of drama to go along with colorful characters. This idea of a bracketed tournament sounds great on paper for people who love the competition part, but B/M and MTV look at that and go.....ehhhh no. Part of the drama and "suspense" is watching the politics play out. In Rivals 2, there was little question who would be 2 of the final teams on the men's side, Wes & CT and Johnny & Frank. Same for BOTS 2. After the first episode it was obvious San Diego was running the game and it was a foregone conclusion what would happen.
The best example of the political game was Fresh Meat 2. I know that season had bad ratings and people here love to hate on it but Kenny's Alliance vs. Wes' alliance was awesome. The drama of the Exiles and the politics made that show worth watching. I'm not going to sit here and say it is the best season in the history of the show because it wasn't. However, I will stand by the fact it was a good season and worth going out of your way to watch if you haven't seen it. Without Fresh Meat 2, it's hard to understand just how surreal Rivals 1 was with the Kenny/Wes team and how it all played out.
For all these reason, if the "drawing a card" aspect of the season holds up, this is a brilliant idea. The drama of fighting for that first place finish on daily challenges takes on new meaning. The political game of "make sure we do everything to make sure this person loses" comes into play as well.
Whether you realize it or not, this is as close to a fair elimination system as The Challenge will ever have.
[QUOTE=CTRoyLeeFAN;388034]Been following this thread for a while and I figured its about time I posted.
This threads all over the place and from what I can see its down to a legitimate final 5 males for sure and speculated final 5 females.
I've gathered enough to assume any of the following males could be out as speculated earlier in the forum.
CT out by Zach
Johnny out via Twitter like
Leroy/Zach potential elimination was mentioned earlier as well as one of the two may not have made it to final
Also on the males side its been speculated that
Leroy/JohhnyB 1st
CT came 2nd
Zach in 3rd
as well as several other potential finishes.
Is this all pure speculation or do people have legitimate sources to back this all up?
Can anyone help me out here? haha[/QUOTE]
Johnny and I have a mutual acquaintance, and according to him, Johnny's phone was off for 4-5 days after he favorited that tweet. As other posters have mentioned, there have been instances in the past where members of the cast have favorited/liked pictures, tweets and statuses while still being on the Challenge.
[QUOTE=ItalianBeats;388017]From this post, I don't get a solid reason on why you'd stop watching...however,
This post kind of connects it (if that what you were going for).
Here's the thing; change needs to happen for the show not to get stale, and from what's taken place this season, it's getting the hype that I hope it lives up to.
We've gone through over 1,000 pages on this thread starter (though a good half of it didn't really relate to this challenge...).
We keep hearing different things day in and day out, some things more surprising than others.
I feel like, if the cards thing were to happen, we'd get a chance to see something happen: nobody being safe because of alliances.
Which I don't know about you guys but I'm going to love this concept if it ends up happening!
We already see what happens when alliances runs the show...things get too predictable and stale, and while the season overall may be great, it'll leave a bad taste knowing that a different outcome could've happened had things went differently.
Put this in another perspective: we have heard that Zach and CT go into an elimination, with CT losing. There might be a way that this can also happen without cards, but it might be a bit difficult to set up.
Cards, in my honest opinion, makes this game much less predictable and that more exciting![/QUOTE]
I don't disagree with you, but the better question is, would anyone aside from the stronger/strongest competitors even want to be a part of it?
I think the main issue we have with the finals is that it was said to be the unusual 4/4 finals. With a 3/3 final, we can eliminate a lot of speculations as it could still be either Johnny B or Leroy win or he's out before the finals + CT's elimination before the final. It could make sense for a change here.
[QUOTE=ItalianBeats;388017]From this post, I don't get a solid reason on why you'd stop watching...however,
This post kind of connects it (if that what you were going for).
Here's the thing; change needs to happen for the show not to get stale, and from what's taken place this season, it's getting the hype that I hope it lives up to.
We've gone through over 1,000 pages on this thread starter (though a good half of it didn't really relate to this challenge...).
We keep hearing different things day in and day out, some things more surprising than others.
I feel like, if the cards thing were to happen, we'd get a chance to see something happen: nobody being safe because of alliances.
Which I don't know about you guys but I'm going to love this concept if it ends up happening!
We already see what happens when alliances runs the show...things get too predictable and stale, and while the season overall may be great, it'll leave a bad taste knowing that a different outcome could've happened had things went differently.
Put this in another perspective: we have heard that Zach and CT go into an elimination, with CT losing. There might be a way that this can also happen without cards, but it might be a bit difficult to set up.
Cards, in my honest opinion, makes this game much less predictable and that more exciting![/QUOTE]
IMO it makes the game boring the whole point of the game isn't to randomly pick a card its to make it to the end. Without politics then its just luck with no skill involved. also picking cards could lead to the same people goingin every time if they have bad luck. You could be dead last in every single mission but if you don't pick the card then you're not going in.
Now I think a March madness one would be pretty cool as long as its all physical eliminations
It wouldn't be the same show without politics....
Politics lead to alliances & drama.. It is a tv show, it isn't all about fairness and competition.
[QUOTE=CTRoyLeeFAN;388034]Been following this thread for a while and I figured its about time I posted.
This threads all over the place and from what I can see its down to a legitimate final 5 males for sure and speculated final 5 females.
I've gathered enough to assume any of the following males could be out as speculated earlier in the forum.
CT out by Zach
Johnny out via Twitter like
Leroy/Zach potential elimination was mentioned earlier as well as one of the two may not have made it to final
Also on the males side its been speculated that
Leroy/JohhnyB 1st
CT came 2nd
Zach in 3rd
as well as several other potential finishes.
Is this all pure speculation or do people have legitimate sources to back this all up?
Can anyone help me out here? haha[/QUOTE]
At this point, wait for molds my friend. I don't know about anyone else but that's what I'm doing.
Welp since you guys don't think it's about the competition might as well just not have eliminations or challenges and call it real world all stars with 28 people. That'll bring in the ratings lol :/
Please.
[QUOTE]Getting rid of the social game will never happen.
[/QUOTE]
Well then the social game needs to change in some way.
[QUOTE]Too many people here on this board look at this show as an athletic competition. While the competition and the athletics are an important aspect, in Bunim & Murray's eyes as well as MTV's, this show is about drama. In their eyes, winning the Challenge is a bonus check for giving B/M and MTV a good season. [/QUOTE]
True I won't argue with you here.
[QUOTE]Also, they do things every season to swing the show a certain way to cause drama and get people talking. Case in point, the Bananas backpack. The producers knew Johnny would be going in at some point and they saved that elimination just for him. Having CT vs. Derrick or CT vs. Abe was not nearly as good a get as Johnny B vs. CT because of their history and open disdain for each other on the show. If they wanted to play it straight, it should have been Johnny vs. Tyler again and may the best man win. But they didn't go that way because throwing in the CT monkeywrench made for better television.[/QUOTE]
Yep uh-huh.
[QUOTE]In a perfect world, The Challenge will be this amazing competition with a lot of drama to go along with colorful characters. This idea of a bracketed tournament sounds great on paper for people who love the competition part, but B/M and MTV look at that and go.....ehhhh no. Part of the drama and "suspense" is watching the politics play out.[B] In Rivals 2, there was little question who would be 2 of the final teams on the men's side, Wes & CT and Johnny & Frank. Same for BOTS 2. After the first episode it was obvious San Diego was running the game and it was a foregone conclusion what would happen.
[/B]
[/QUOTE]
See THAT'S the problem I'm having with this show right now. The PREDICTABILITY of it all. I shouldn't be able to tell from the 2nd episode who is going to win on Battle of the Seasons 2. I shouldn't be able to know who's going to get the shaft at the final challenge in Rivals 2. I should be guessing until the very end. There's no shock, suspense, or surprise. and THAT'S what I wanna see.
[QUOTE]The best example of the political game was Fresh Meat 2. I know that season had bad ratings and people here love to hate on it but Kenny's Alliance vs. Wes' alliance was awesome. The drama of the Exiles and the politics made that show worth watching. I'm not going to sit here and say it is the best season in the history of the show because it wasn't. However, I will stand by the fact it was a good season and worth going out of your way to watch if you haven't seen it. Without Fresh Meat 2, it's hard to understand just how surreal Rivals 1 was with the Kenny/Wes team and how it all played out.[/QUOTE]
I'm sorry but Kenny vs Wes was NOT awesome in any way. It never lead to anything memorable or entertaining and Fresh Meat 2 was a Mediocre Season. I will say that it was probably the most strategic season this show has had. But that's not really saying much honestly. Not a damn thing was surreal about Kenny and Wes Boring *** rivalry.
[QUOTE]For all these reason, if the "drawing a card" aspect of the season holds up, this is a brilliant idea. The drama of fighting for that first place finish on daily challenges takes on new meaning. The political game of "make sure we do everything to make sure this person loses" comes into play as well.
[/QUOTE]
And I would be okay with it...as long as it lead to something interesting to watch.
[QUOTE]Whether you realize it or not, this is as close to a fair elimination system as The Challenge will ever have.[/QUOTE]
As long as it leads to something different. I really don't care.
[QUOTE=Lola88;388061]Welp since you guys don't think it's about the competition might as well just not have eliminations or challenges and call it real world all stars with 28 people. That'll bring in the ratings lol :/
Please.[/QUOTE]
It is a mixture of competiton and the drama.. That is what brings ratings.
[QUOTE=JEKFAN;388059]It wouldn't be the same show without politics....
Politics lead to alliances & drama.. It is a tv show, it isn't all about fairness and competition.[/QUOTE]
And that's all fine and dandy. But The Drama and Politics are predictable and boring. Like I said before. No Suspense, No Surprises, nothing of that nature. I don't have a problem with Politics or Drama. It's just they're like a broken record now.
[QUOTE=Lola88;388061]Welp since you guys don't think it's about the competition might as well just not have eliminations or challenges and call it real world all stars with 28 people. That'll bring in the ratings lol :/
Please.[/QUOTE]
It is about competition but it is only used as part of the narrative device, it is not the main focus. It is a plot device.
I enjoy the competition of The Challenge but for it to be a good season you need good challenges, a tough final, good cast, some drama, some politics, and a storyline.
If you look at each season it's obvious what the storyline is and the editing revolves around it.
Rivals 2: CT gets his first win.
Battle of the Seasons: The Rookie Revolution
Battle of the Exes: Can CT and Diem overcome their history, work together, and win?
Rivals 1: Can CT and Adam work together? Can Kenny and Wes work together?
Cutthroat: Brad finally wins The Challenge
Fresh Meat 2: Kenny vs. Wes, who is better? Neither we found out because Landon won.
The Ruins: Everybody hates Wes and JEK wants to cut every girl from their team.
The Island: Johnny Bananas is a jerk and can Evelyn survive to get a key?
The competition is important but without all the other ingredients, the majority of the viewers don't care.
[QUOTE=Debut Album;388032]That actually is a good Idea.
And I don't think that people hate others who are good at the social aspect..It's just the same things keep happening and people are tired of it. This show needs a change. It needs a shake up and getting rid of the social game may be just what the doctor ordered.
I say make it happen BMP![/QUOTE]
Hey, I can live with a March Madness type challenge but I think many fans would be lived.
It sure as hell better give us the best of the best though
[QUOTE=datraceman;388065]It is about competition but it is only used as part of the narrative device, it is not the main focus. It is a plot device.
I enjoy the competition of The Challenge but for it to be a good season you need good challenges, a tough final, good cast, some drama, some politics, and a storyline.
If you look at each season it's obvious what the storyline is and the editing revolves around it.
Rivals 2: CT gets his first win.
Battle of the Seasons: The Rookie Revolution
Battle of the Exes: Can CT and Diem overcome their history, work together, and win?
Rivals 1: Can CT and Adam work together? Can Kenny and Wes work together?
Cutthroat: Brad finally wins The Challenge
Fresh Meat 2: Kenny vs. Wes, who is better? Neither we found out because Landon won.
The Ruins: Everybody hates Wes and JEK wants to cut every girl from their team.
The Island: Johnny Bananas is a jerk and can Evelyn survive to get a key?
The competition is important but without all the other ingredients, the majority of the viewers don't care.[/QUOTE]
What about The Duel 2?
[QUOTE=El Scorcho;388068]What about The Duel 2?[/QUOTE]
In my opinion the plot lines were can Mark Long hang with these younger guys, is Evan all hype or can he win a Challenge, can Brad prove that making it to the end of Duel 1 wasn't a fluke, and can Rachel make it without Veronica.
[QUOTE=Lola88;388061]Welp since you guys don't think it's about the competition might as well just not have eliminations or challenges and call it real world all stars with 28 people. That'll bring in the ratings lol :/
Please.[/QUOTE]
Where did you get this from what people have posted that politics shouldn't and won't be leaving anytime soon? Some of the more popular people to ever do these are known for their political games: Veronica, Coral, Darrell. Honestly, if Johnny wasn't as good as he was at the social game/politics and certain people's favorites were, I doubt there'd be an issue.
[QUOTE=GiggidyGoo90;388074]In my opinion the plot lines were can Mark Long hang with these younger guys, is Evan all hype or can he win a Challenge, can Brad prove that making it to the end of Duel 1 wasn't a fluke, and can Rachel make it without Veronica.[/QUOTE]
That and holy cow CT might murder Adam.
[QUOTE=Debut Album;388062]Well then the social game needs to change in some way.
True I won't argue with you here.
Yep uh-huh.
See THAT'S the problem I'm having with this show right now. The PREDICTABILITY of it all. I shouldn't be able to tell from the 2nd episode who is going to win on Battle of the Seasons 2. I shouldn't be able to know who's going to get the shaft at the final challenge in Rivals 2. I should be guessing until the very end. There's no shock, suspense, or surprise. and THAT'S what I wanna see.
I'm sorry but Kenny vs Wes was NOT awesome in any way. It never lead to anything memorable or entertaining and Fresh Meat 2 was a Mediocre Season. I will say that it was probably the most strategic season this show has had. But that's not really saying much honestly. Not a damn thing was surreal about Kenny and Wes Boring *** rivalry.
And I would be okay with it...as long as it lead to something interesting to watch.
As long as it leads to something different. I really don't care.[/QUOTE]
Thats why if there going to do individual challenges, they need to have as many strong players as possible to make it a little unpredictable!
so does anybody else think that johnny reilly might have actually won this challenge, because I do.
there has been no true speculation on who finished in what place and nobody has thrown out reilly's name on where he has been speculated to finish
also nia did tweet him "congratulations" a while back and then deleted it, could it be because he actually won? just a thought I've been having
[QUOTE=achedcobra;388086]so does anybody else think that johnny reilly might have actually won this challenge, because I do.
there has been no true speculation on who finished in what place and nobody has thrown out reilly's name on where he has been speculated to finish
also nia did tweet him "congratulations" a while back and then deleted it, could it be because he actually won? just a thought I've been having[/QUOTE]That would be crazy because people automatically assume it must have been someone like Leroy or Bananas. But who knows, what if Johnny turned out to be a fierce competitor, or some technicality made it so Johnny was considered the winner and that was the scandal.
Nia's congrats could have been about Johnny just making it to the end.
If Johnny won though, that would be the best showing of any rookie ever if he beat every guy. Lol.
Um, you don't come across as very informed. It's a word used all over by all types of people who wish to point out a bad characteristic about someone. It may not be part of your vocabulary, but it's just another word for sexist, which longtime fans of the show have accused Bananas of being for years. Are you implying that it doesn't exist? What's next? You're going to say only losers and butthurt minorities use the word racist? What a fatuous comment.
And it's "misogynist", I spelled it right for you on the post that you responded to. It might be best to get the word you're trying to mock right. Just a tip.
[QUOTE=JayTee;387956]Mysogonist? LMAO
The only people that throw that word around are butthurt feminists and guys that can't********.
Johnny is an awesome competitor and I don't mind having him compete for a couple more challenges.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=achedcobra;388086]so does anybody else think that johnny reilly might have actually won this challenge, because I do.
there has been no true speculation on who finished in what place and nobody has thrown out reilly's name on where he has been speculated to finish
also nia did tweet him "congratulations" a while back and then deleted it, could it be because he actually won? just a thought I've been having[/QUOTE]
I thought the "congratulations" tweet was about the breakup.
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