The Challenge Series: RW/RR (Generic Thread)

[QUOTE=Adrian!!!!!!;211033]It's pretty obvious if you ask me. Wes also blew up big time from Fresh Meat to The Duel and there was only like a few months from the end of Fresh Meat to The Duel, that was real obvious that Wes was taking performance enhancers to me.[/QUOTE] I agree, Wes was small and kinda pudgy on Fresh Meat, then on the Duel he was very defined and jacked up.

I'm not saying whether or not I believe any of them took roids, but to me, it's pretty sad if you're willing to compromise your body like that for [I]challenges[/I], of all things.

[QUOTE=realworldstd;211017]I was so giddy with excitement for that podcast as I am a regular listener and reader of Bill Simmons and always watch the Challenge. I have to say that exceeded my expectations and can't wait for Cutthroat. CT!!!!!!!!!!! On a somewhat related note, I'm trying to compile a list of everyone who has been thrown off the show for fighting or any other reason and how many times for my blog. I know CT has been tossed at least twice for fighting, maybe more. If people can help out, much appreciated.[/QUOTE] Tina, Adam, Darrell and Brad. I think Danny got the most Jacked from FM to Inferno 3. I don't think there's a question whether or not some of the guys are taking enhancing performing drugs.

[QUOTE=Moonpaw;211073]I'm not saying whether or not I believe any of them took roids, but to me, it's pretty sad if you're willing to compromise your body like that for [I]challenges[/I], of all things.[/QUOTE] A lot of people, while still suffering the side effects, don't have too much damage done to themselves, while others do. It's also a lot of money that they're competing for, but taking steroids doesn't guarentee you a win. If we are correct about the people who've taken them, it worked somewhat for Wes, while it definitely didn't work for Danny.

[QUOTE=Morris1721;211080]A lot of people, while still suffering the side effects, don't have too much damage done to themselves, while others do. It's also a lot of money that they're competing for, but taking steroids doesn't guarentee you a win. If we are correct about the people who've taken them, it worked somewhat for Wes, while it definitely didn't work for Danny.[/QUOTE] And it didnt really work that well for Wes, he only won 2 missions in the Duel, only got to the finals thanks to great manipulation, and won the final thanks to a soccer kick.

There's a lot of speculation that Wes did, but for some reason I don't think he has. Just looking at his size, he's been roughly the same the entire time. He was definitely more toned on the Duel but the way Nehemiah put on it on the Duel aftershow was that "you do one of these (challenges) and you get an idea of what to expect." Wes knew he was outgunned by all the bigger dogs on Fresh Meat (Theo, Darrell, Evan) so he went to work for the Duel. I'm not sure that's performance enhancing drugs or just knowing that in advance you're gonna be on the next challenge. If anything don't people feel like Wes's arms are smaller if anything from when he as on Austin. He had ridiculously disproportionate arms back on his season. If anything though, his temper and mood swings would be the tell tale sign for me, but that's very circumstantial. To be honest I couldn't really pinpoint one challenger for sure and say "that guy definitely is."

[QUOTE=Entropy;210962]I actually like TJ after the interview cause I always thought he didn't like doing the show, but from the interview it seems he truly enjoys it, and I agree, seeing those morning afters must be awesome.[/QUOTE] I was very iffy reading about the interview, but after a good debate with myself, I listened to it. It was very interesting to say the least and I think I like TJ way more than I did. He just always seemed so....blah. That's probably the best word to use. I always found Johnny Moseley way more entertaining, but I guess I can see TJ somewhat entertaining now, possibly even more after the Evelyn comment during Fresh Meat 2. I can't even fathom what would happen if they were allowed to throw punches at each other though, even if they had a padded room. That would get crazy. Although I think that ratings/drama would go up, which would be a great thing. I think one of the only things I didn't like about the interview is when they started talking Jersey Shore and Bad Girls Club and how they should be on the challenges as well. I think it's the fact that I've seen almost every season and a big switch up like that would be too much in the I Love Money direction and I wouldn't like that.

I agree I am anti Jersey Shore/BGC being added to the mix, it would be the one thing to cause me to never EVER watch again.

If Jersey Shore had different people each season then I'd be up for it, but only the same 8 people kind of ruins their chances.

For starters, I dont think it 100% matters if cast members from non-Real world/Road Rules shows join in, after all the show has now done away with the whole 'Real World/Road Rules' tag, in fact it minght be in the shows benefit to spread the net further. ------------ On another topic, anyone mind if I share my list of challenges from least to fave? :P 15: Battle of the Seasons + Miz Time, The Chaos with the Backstabbing from Emily against Veronica/Yes. - The pointless amount of challenges once the eliminations stopped, a lot of meh episodes and the fact I cant remember it 100% since its been a while since I watched. 14: The Island + Drama, Rachel/Jenn, More Drama, Occasinally wondering what will happen thanks to unclear rules - Unclear rules, complicated rules, annoying rules and annoying winners 13: Fresh Meat 2 + Kenny vs Wes, The Scheming, Theresa Luvs Kenny... I mean Wes, Good challenges. - Unexiting cast, Kenny vs Wes, Stupid Gameplay, Some dull episodes 12: Inferno 3 + Paula vs Aneesa again, First Night Blowout, Almost balanced Elimination and Challenge-wise - Boring storylines, Unbalanced final challenge setup (Im sure every girl on the bad ***** team could wipe out any of the good guys girls), Timmys quite unfair DQ 11: Battle of the Sexes 2 + Intresting arguments, Funny challenges, some shock eliminations of vets, the start of the whole 'Rookies vs Vets' thing, intresting cast - Most unbalanced cast, at times very easy to predict whats going to happen, the mens team members just being okay with getting eliminated 10: Gauntlet 3 + Introduction of 45 min episodes, good amount of drama, several backstabs, hookups, basically everything from classic days are here... - But it doesnt feel as 'fresh', unbalanced teams, repeated talks of 'throwing womens missions' yet the show drags it out for several episodes 9: Battle of the Sexes + Varied cast, good drama moments, Pucks wedding, general fun feel which is sometimes missing nowadays, Emily vs Veronica, Puck vs Ellen - Final challenge, some episodes can feel a bit vacant and by the numbers boring, scoring system and inner-circle system is a bit rubbish 8: Inferno 2 + Drama Drama Drama, Memorable Challenges, Underdog ending - Mostly unlikable cast (For me anyway) 7: Gauntlet + Underdog story (GO SARAH!), Coral vs Miz vs Trishelle, Spider Bite, Enough Drama, Shower Fun, Sense of fun still present - At times predictable, edit issues and THAT ice cream challenge 6: Fresh Meat + Memorable casting, Good Competition, Shock exits - Needless 2nd round episodes for the life-saver. 5: Inferno + Continuing Drama from Gauntlet, the whole Kendal vs Leah Inferno, Katie vs almost all her team, Coral vs Julie, Shanes shock finding himself against CT - Again at times predictable 4: The Ruins (Unlike some, I can actually like Kenny/Evan alliance, not Johnny though XD) + Fights, Arguments, General Chaos, Tonya finally slapping Veronica, Caseys failures, some great Ruin games - Completely overbalanced 3: Duel 2 + Good Strategy, some shock upsets (Kim vs Ruthie? Who woulda thought it), Paula drama, Rachel and Jenn drama, Good Casting, Adam vs CT, Personal preference to liking the Duel format. 2: Duel + Anyones game, Personal liking for format, Aneesa vs Robin, Beth vs Tina and Kina, Diem and CT, CT's anger at losing - Two horrible duel games (Push me and Do it) 1: Gauntlet 2 + Great casting, Jo freaking out, continuation of Beth/Mark/Robin/Tonya chaos with Jodi adding to it, Danny vs the rest of the X-Treme cast, Derricks story, Syrus vs TJ, Great challenges, close-cut challenges, Aneesa vs Cara, The alliance conspiracy all wrapping up to make my fave challenge. - Poor final challenge

[QUOTE=jamesbuc;211211]On another topic, anyone mind if I share my list of challenges from least to fave? :P [/QUOTE] Pretty out there list different from a lot of peoples which is always interesting to read. I'm really surprised you have the Inferno 2 cast as one of the most unlikeable since it featured pretty much a top ten of everybody's favorites. For me it's between this cast and Battle of the Sexes 2 for the best cast assembled, although BOTS2 had the advantage of being able to cast way more members. I liked you having Gauntlet 2 so high, it's not my absolute favorite but it's definitely in the top 3. A lot of people rate it poorly but I loved the season. Everybody seemed like they were having a good time. Both teams were equally stacked and although the rookies pulled ahead most of the missions were still really close, it wasn't a blowout by any means. The final challenge was a bit of a let down, it would have been great to have it be your typical triathlon/race format. I also agree with there being something stale about Gauntlet 3. For me it was all about how outclassed the rookies were. It was a completely unwatchable beat down. Plus all the male rookies with the exception of Frank were complete let downs. I don't know how they were expecting Derek, Zach, Tyler, Ryan, Alex to compete with the likes of CT, Evan, Kenny, Brad, and Johnny.

Challenge 21 may be the first cast in a while so many rookies.. the FM2 who aren't on Cutthroat, The rest of the D.C. and Cancun cast that heven't been on and all the NOLA kids.

I like your list as well, but I wouldn't have the Duel 2 so high up on mine. I found it boring with the same people winning over and over and the same alliance running it all. I hope for the Duel 3, given it actually happens, they make them pick the order right then and there with no deliberation time. Club, I agree about the Gauntlet 3, but I think Derek was the best male on the team. It was a complete fluke that he lost to Ryan, stupid Sliders ruined the Rookies lol.

[QUOTE=Entropy;211215]Challenge 21 may be the first cast in a while so many rookies.. the FM2 who aren't on Cutthroat, The rest of the D.C. and Cancun cast that heven't been on and all the NOLA kids.[/QUOTE] And it's funny, if it's Rookies vs. Vets again, there's only 6 people from FM2 that would be on the rookie team; Noor, Sandy, Sydney, Carley, Jeff, and Pete...I think they'd all be pretty good rookies. Honestly with them, plus maybe Emily from DC, I don't see the Rookies standing any chance against any Vet team that could be made up.

[QUOTE] Challenge 21 may be the first cast in a while so many rookies.. the FM2 who aren't on Cutthroat, The rest of the D.C. and Cancun cast that heven't been on and all the NOLA kids. [/QUOTE] After Cutthroat, we will get challenge seasons with a new generation cast starting from RW: Brooklyn with Fresh Meat II. We aren't going to see many Vets. We will see Jenn, Evelyn, and Kenny. No more Derrick, Abram, and Katie. I can see some of these challenge vets coming back for the Duel 2 or whatever challenge is next: Darrell, Syrus, Alton, Adam Larson, Tina, Diem, Julie, Jodi, and Aneesa Imagine Jodi's return for Challenge 21, ready to win the Duel 3. I can see a promo like a Jodi promo saying she's back to win another Duel and stuff like that. Showing clips of her dominating performance on the first Duel, then you could see people going out to get her.

I think that the next may be the begining of the new challenge generation. Of course MTV could screw it up and make the cast an epic fail.

Reality Toast you may get an infraction for your youtube mention.. As for the vets, as long as they yes I dont see MTV saying no to them, they know they bring some fans with them. I was thinking after the TJ interview how he said he doesnt like them sending the same person over and over, that they should do a 3rd times the charm rule, basically if a person is sent in 3 times and wins..they can't be sent in again and are guaranteed a spot in the final. This can open the door for so many things, either big dogs volunteering the 3 times to assure their spots in the finals, but risking themselves losing, and this also eliminates someone going in every single time.

[QUOTE=Entropy;211221] I was thinking after the TJ interview how he said he doesnt like them sending the same person over and over, that they should do a 3rd times the charm rule, basically if a person is sent in 3 times and wins..they can't be sent in again and are guaranteed a spot in the final. This can open the door for so many things, either big dogs volunteering the 3 times to assure their spots in the finals, but risking themselves losing, and this also eliminates someone going in every single time.[/QUOTE] That is a pretty cool idea. I would like to see that. Or at least let the person have a break from the next few duels. Judging by the lack of vets on this challenge, you can be sure many vets won't be back. You can count on the regulars: Paula, Ryan, Jenn, Ev, Kenny, Johnny and Evan but I think Katie, Derick and Abram are all going to throw in the rag. On another note, I loved Battle of the Seasons: Kelly killing the climbing mission, Belou blowing up at Chadwick and Holly, The Toga Party, Stephen, The missions, Road Rules not having there act together. I loved the cast. They way they put it together was very well done (editing wise), the music and drama was great!

[QUOTE=Entropy;211221]Reality Toast you may get an infraction for your youtube mention.. As for the vets, as long as they yes I dont see MTV saying no to them, they know they bring some fans with them. I was thinking after the TJ interview how he said he doesnt like them sending the same person over and over, that they should do a 3rd times the charm rule, [B]basically if a person is sent in 3 times and wins..they can't be sent in again and are guaranteed a spot in the final.[/B] This can open the door for so many things, either big dogs volunteering the 3 times to assure their spots in the finals, but risking themselves losing, and this also eliminates someone going in every single time.[/QUOTE] That is a great ****** idea. It would definitely throw a wrench into things.

[QUOTE=ClubSandwich;211212]Pretty out there list different from a lot of peoples which is always interesting to read. I'm really surprised you have the Inferno 2 cast as one of the most unlikeable since it featured pretty much a top ten of everybody's favorites. For me it's between this cast and Battle of the Sexes 2 for the best cast assembled, although BOTS2 had the advantage of being able to cast way more members.[/QUOTE] Its probably so down on the list probably because of the fact that I watched through Battle of the Seasons to The Island with no real time-gap in between so a lot of the cast (Darrell, Abram, Veronica, Rachel, Miz, Tina, Tonya) I was already over and done with in some ways. In fact it would be lower if I hadnt rewatched the series recently. Ive tried watching The Island also again but its still as irritating. [QUOTE=ClubSandwich;211212]I also agree with there being something stale about Gauntlet 3. For me it was all about how outclassed the rookies were. It was a completely unwatchable beat down. Plus all the male rookies with the exception of Frank were complete let downs. I don't know how they were expecting Derek, Zach, Tyler, Ryan, Alex to compete with the likes of CT, Evan, Kenny, Brad, and Johnny.[/QUOTE] Honestly it wasnt actually the complete outclassing of teams. It was just that none of the drama/hookups stuck well thanks to the restrictive 2 challenges/2 eliminations leaving not enough time for any of the infomation or events to really stick well, in fact thats why I do like the Ruins/Duel 2 because they made use of the 45 minute time area a lot better whereas the Island wasted a lot of time with garbage. -------------------------------- Just a note though when fans do complain about the unbalanced teams (Ruins/Gauntlet 3 being the main targets). Im pretty darn sure that a lot of the earlier ones had just the SAME issue (Battle of the Sexes 2, Gauntlet, Inferno, any of the 6 vs 6 format challenges) yet they dont seem to be glossed over a lot of the time. Not saying they are bad seasons though, ill make that clear.

[QUOTE=jamesbuc;211293] Just a note though when fans do complain about the unbalanced teams (Ruins/Gauntlet 3 being the main targets). Im pretty darn sure that a lot of the earlier ones had just the SAME issue (Battle of the Sexes 2, Gauntlet, Inferno, any of the 6 vs 6 format challenges) yet they dont seem to be glossed over a lot of the time. Not saying they are bad seasons though, ill make that clear.[/QUOTE] Well BOTSexes2 the men and women were essentially competing with themselves, not between each other which is the way I took the challenge. There was more animosity within the women directed at each other than there was at the men. For the guys it was the suspense of seeing who was gonna screw up that day and be sent home that made it exciting for me. Although I knew the final challenge was a complete wash from the get go. The Gauntlet was closer than people think. The Real World definitely needed to trim some fat, but they came on strong at the end. So strong I legitimately thought they were gonna win at the end. It was definitely a bit tough to watch in the middle for me though, I can't lie. Inferno is one of my least favorite challenges, but you're right there, a lot of people rate it really highly, but I think those are the same people that can't get over the fact Timmy, Shane, Miz and anybody pre RW14/RR13 aren't doing challenges anymore and consider it the last bastion of the challenge glory days. It did have some entertaining elimination rounds. It's definitely a good theory, but for me Inferno, G3 and Ruins are in my top 4 least favorite challenges. Funny part is I'm actually eager for another Ruins since the concept is pretty solid in my mind.

My problem with The Ruins is that the concept had a lot of potential, and the casting was flawed. While I applaud production for bringing back Syrus, Darrell, and Veronica after long absences, casting Johnny, Evan, and Kenny together on the same team (after we had seen them all together as teammates on Gauntlet 3) was a huge mistake. It made The Ruins too annoying and predictable. I could have done without Johanna and Ibis as well, considering they won their Challenges by default and they did nothing but blindly follow JEK. I just think that if you take away JEK, Johanna, and Ibis from the Champions team and replace them with, say, Abram, Alton, Landon, Coral, and Rachel, and I think you have a more well-executed season that a lot of us old-school enthusiasts would have enjoyed. I wouldn't even have minded seeing one of JEK on that team, but three of them at a time is unbearable. We'll see how Johnny fares in his first go round as a lone wolf.

[QUOTE=AJHill;211315]My problem with The Ruins is that the concept had a lot of potential, and the casting was flawed. While I applaud production for bringing back Syrus, Darrell, and Veronica after long absences, casting Johnny, Evan, and Kenny together on the same team (after we had seen them all together as teammates on Gauntlet 3) was a huge mistake. It made The Ruins too annoying and predictable. I could have done without Johanna and Ibis as well, considering they won their Challenges by default and they did nothing but blindly follow JEK. I just think that if you take away JEK, Johanna, and Ibis from the Champions team and replace them with, say, [B]Abram, Alton, Landon, Coral, and Rachel,[/B] and I think you have a more well-executed season that a lot of us old-school enthusiasts would have enjoyed. I wouldn't even have minded seeing one of JEK on that team, but three of them at a time is unbearable. We'll see how Johnny fares in his first go round as a lone wolf.[/QUOTE] It's good in theory, but who knows if Alton and Coral are still interested in doing challenges.

[QUOTE=AJHill;211315]My problem with The Ruins is that the concept had a lot of potential, and the casting was flawed. While I applaud production for bringing back Syrus, Darrell, and Veronica after long absences, casting Johnny, Evan, and Kenny together on the same team (after we had seen them all together as teammates on Gauntlet 3) was a huge mistake. It made The Ruins too annoying and predictable. I could have done without Johanna and Ibis as well, considering they won their Challenges by default and they did nothing but blindly follow JEK. I just think that if you take away JEK, Johanna, and Ibis from the Champions team and replace them with, say, [B]Abram, Alton, Landon, Coral, and Rachel[/B], and I think you have a more well-executed season that a lot of us old-school enthusiasts would have enjoyed. I wouldn't even have minded seeing one of JEK on that team, but three of them at a time is unbearable. We'll see how Johnny fares in his first go round as a lone wolf.[/QUOTE] I see where you are coming from, but considering those people are seen as strong competitors by most, it would still be a one-sided season with the Champions dominating. That's how I see it at least.

Anyway you look at it, the Champions production and the people would want back, would dominate the competition. I also really enjoyed the cast and the dynamics. It was good to see a bunch of old school vets Veronica, Darrell, Wes, Ibis and Syrus and some new blood Sarah, Kim, Cohutta and KellyAnne mixed with some favorites Katie and Brad. I don't like the idea that they put Johnny, Evan and Kenny all on the same challenge, but I still think the casting was great.

[QUOTE=CrazyRealityGuy;211324]Anyway you look at it, the Champions production and the people would want back, would dominate the competition. I also really enjoyed the cast and the dynamics. It was good to see a bunch of old school vets Veronica, Darrell, Wes, Ibis and Syrus and some new blood Sarah, Kim, Cohutta and KellyAnne mixed with some favorites Katie and Brad. I don't like the idea that they put Johnny, Evan and Kenny all on the same challenge, but I still think the casting was great.[/QUOTE] I completely agree. I thought The Ruins was well casted as well and seeing some old vets mixed in with new blood, it was enjoyable. I personally like Johnny, Evan, and Kenny on the same challenge, but I think if they ever do that again that I would want to see them on separate teams just to see how the dynamics would work.

[QUOTE=fabulous788;211325]I completely agree. I thought The Ruins was well casted as well and seeing some old vets mixed in with new blood, it was enjoyable. I personally like Johnny, Evan, and Kenny on the same challenge, but I think if they ever do that again that I would want to see them on separate teams just to see how the dynamics would work.[/QUOTE] Me too. I wouldn't mind seeing them all again, if they were on different teams. And on G3 Evan picked Johnny first. I think Kenny is the glue that holds them together. I enjoyed the ruins. The drama, the fights and implant pop!

Johnny to me is their scape goat, if they need to sacrifice someone he's the easy pick.

[QUOTE=fabulous788;211323]I see where you are coming from, but considering those people are seen as strong competitors by most, it would still be a one-sided season with the Champions dominating. That's how I see it at least.[/QUOTE] My problem wasn't so much with the Champions dominating (that's what happens when you cast useless players like Casey on the other team), I expected that. My problem was with the Champions team not being objective as to who should go into the elimination rounds. I feel like if you make a couple of the tweaks to that team out of the ones I mentioned, it becomes a lot less predictable and the eliminations become a little bit more interesting.

[QUOTE=AJHill;211330]My problem wasn't so much with the Champions dominating (that's what happens when you cast useless players like Casey on the other team), I expected that. My problem was with the Champions team not being objective as to who should go into the elimination rounds. I feel like if you make a couple of the tweaks to that team out of the ones I mentioned, it becomes a lot less predictable and the eliminations become a little bit more interesting.[/QUOTE] Ahhh, okay. I'm not the biggest fan of predictable and I'm sure not too many people are. That probably would have been more interesting in all aspects, but I also think some of the Challengers should have been others as well.