Personally, I don' think half-hour format is good for storytelling. The hour format allows the viewer to see a challenge and then subsequently show why people are selected for elimination. It's like one-standalone story. The half hour format breaks things up and has a more disjointed story.
[QUOTE=SurferZ;221184]Personally, I don' think half-hour format is good for storytelling. The hour format allows the viewer to see a challenge and then subsequently show why people are selected for elimination. It's like one-standalone story. The half hour format breaks things up and has a more disjointed story.[/QUOTE]
I used to think the hour format was the way to go, but that has changed over time as ratings have declined.
My current thinking is that if MTV was to do another Challenge, they should cut the waste and make this show more profitable.
The first thing I would do is get rid of the exotic locations. Stay stateside and film where it is cheap. A "Gulag" is a "Gulag" and looks the same no matter where it is staged. There is a reason most reality shows take place near LA - an infrastructure is in place and there is plenty of available crew talent. If Cleveland is cheaper, do Cleveland. It doesn't matter. Remove location from the equation as unlike in some senses The Real World, the Challenges are not about locale.
Film challenges back to back at the same location with different themes (and cast variation.) Survivor has done this to great effect and there is no reason it can't be done here as well.
Cut the on location time in half per Challenge (plus a week set/cast swap.) In order to achieve this they will need to cut the participant cast size in half per Challenge - which in effect means 30 minutes episodes. Thus, with approximatively the same location time and cast size that once only made one show, you have created two shows (not to mention many cast members will be on both iterations thus cutting some transport costs.)
To make up for the lost 30 minutes per episode, in two sittings (one after each Challenge end) film an Aftershow for each episode in each Challenge. The Aftershow in general does not fall off too much from the primary episode and is cheap. Keep in reserve some of the better Dailies material to fill most of these episodes. While the web might one day be really profitable, right now television pays the bills. Also, if this show is going to air at 10PM there is no reason to not show the more "mature" type footage. We are talking about cable here and everyone else is doing it. Make sure to tease additional salacious footage during the actual episodes. If something "hot" like the Laurel controversy crops up, dedicate an entire half hour to it. Be flexible to take advantage of what the cast has given you.
Cut the cash prize money in half, offer a greater share to the winners to keep prospective cast members interested (this will probably eliminate team based Challenges.) Back fill total prize with sponsor fluff.
Make an hour long "Welcome" episode. They are cheap. Show the cast members. Throw in some behind the scenes footage of set construction, etc. Also, have a mid season episode which recaps everything thus far with a narrator. Throw in some more behind the scenes footage.
Finally, find a sponsor for the entire show. Get a sponsor's name in the title of the show (i.e The Kicker Audio Challenge: Death Adder) and kick up product placements. If the "Gulag" has to be a giant molded subwoofer, so be it.
[QUOTE=Bacchus;221187]I used to think the hour format was the way to go, but that has changed over time as ratings have declined.
My current thinking is that if MTV was to do another Challenge, they should cut the waste and make this show more profitable.
The first thing I would do is get rid of the exotic locations. Stay stateside and film where it is cheap. A "Gulag" is a "Gulag" and looks the same no matter where it is staged. There is a reason most reality shows take place near LA - an infrastructure is in place and there is plenty of available crew talent. If Cleveland is cheaper, do Cleveland. It doesn't matter. Remove location from the equation as unlike in some senses The Real World, the Challenges are not about locale.
Film challenges back to back at the same location with different themes (and cast variation.) Survivor has done this to great effect and there is no reason it can't be done here as well.
Cut the on location time in half per Challenge (plus a week set/cast swap.) In order to achieve this they will need to cut the participant cast size in half per Challenge - which in effect means 30 minutes episodes. Thus, with approximatively the same location time and cast size that once only made one show, you have created two shows (not to mention many cast members will be on both iterations thus cutting some transport costs.)
To make up for the lost 30 minutes per episode, in two sittings (one after each Challenge end) film an Aftershow for each episode in each Challenge. The Aftershow in general does not fall off too much from the primary episode and is cheap. Keep in reserve some of the better Dailies material to fill most of these episodes. While the web might one day be really profitable, right now television pays the bills. Also, if this show is going to air at 10PM there is no reason to not show the more "mature" type footage. We are talking about cable here and everyone else is doing it. Make sure to tease additional salacious footage during the actual episodes. If something "hot" like the Laurel controversy crops up, dedicate an entire half hour to it. Be flexible to take advantage of what the cast has given you.
Cut the cash prize money in half, offer a greater share to the winners to keep prospective cast members interested (this will probably eliminate team based Challenges.) Back fill total prize with sponsor fluff.
Make an hour long "Welcome" episode. They are cheap. Show the cast members. Throw in some behind the scenes footage of set construction, etc. Also, have a mid season episode which recaps everything thus far with a narrator. Throw in some more behind the scenes footage.
Finally, find a sponsor for the entire show. Get a sponsor's name in the title of the show (i.e The Kicker Audio Challenge: Death Adder) and kick up product placements. If the "Gulag" has to be a giant molded subwoofer, so be it.[/QUOTE]
Genius.
I think few networks have seen better EP or creative director resumes than your comments above. The ideas a solid, quickly actionable, and likely very profitable. Sadly, it may be too late to save the series.
Bacchus, that is a great idea. Honestly, I prefered the 30 minute challenge seasons even though I only saw three (Fresh Meat, Duel, and Inferno 3). The half-hour challenges gave me something to look foward to each week. Don't get me wrong, I still like the Challenge series, it just could be a bit better. I totally agree that they should bring back the After Shows and the preview specials.
I think that if they were to go to 1/2 hour episodes then they should prolong the elimination process to at least two episodes per elimination. I always assume the foreign sets are to escape having unionized crews. Certainly some state travel offices may be willing to subsidize the production if they pitch the state in some way. I would rather see RW go back to 30 minutes than the Challenges though.
[QUOTE=SeanDaniel;221254][B]I think that if they were to go to 1/2 hour episodes then they should prolong the elimination process to at least two episodes per elimination. [/B] I always assume the foreign sets are to escape having unionized crews. Certainly some state travel offices may be willing to subsidize the production if they pitch the state in some way. I would rather see RW go back to 30 minutes than the Challenges though.[/QUOTE]
That's how the challenges from BOTS to Gauntlet 2ish were set up.
As to you Bacchus, I can see it now...
The Challenge: Detroit
Challenge 1: Walk around the Joe Louis Arena area at night and don't get shot.
Challenge 2: Walk around the Cass Corridor at night and don't get shot.
Challenge 3: Road trip to Flint; don't get shot.
etc.
[QUOTE=CastAStone;221264]That's how the challenges from BOTS to Gauntlet 2ish were set up.
As to you Bacchus, I can see it now...
The Challenge: Detroit
Challenge 1: Walk around the Joe Louis Arena area at night and don't get shot.
Challenge 2: Walk around the Cass Corridor at night and don't get shot.
Challenge 3: Road trip to Flint; don't get shot.
etc.[/QUOTE]
TJ Lavin: Welcome to your first elimination round here in "beautiful Detroit, Michigan". CT, Landon you guys will be playing Shoot 'em Up. To start each guy will be standing on the opposite ends of this historically abandoned train tracks. On my go, you will then have to charge into each other and to try to knock off the block attached to your opponents head without using your arms and legs. The first person to successful knock their opponents block off twice without being shot by local gang members who wonder on to this set by random will win tonights elimination round, return to their team and win this Dr. Dre limited edition diamond encrusted bulletproof vest. Worth playing for? All right lets get you guys suited up.
CastAStone, there are lots of ways they could do that and still be interesting--kayak racing in the New River Gorge; cross country/repelling in WV; some sort of relay along the Appalachian Trial; anything along any of the billion miles of beaches in the US. I reject the notion that much of anything that could be done overseas could not be just as easily done in pretty much any field anywhere in the US. I was glad to see them go to Canada. I have yet to figure out why they send the Challenges overseas and not TRW.
[QUOTE=SeanDaniel;221267]CastAStone, there are lots of ways they could do that and still be interesting--kayak racing in the New River Gorge; cross country/repelling in WV; some sort of relay along the Appalachian Trial; anything along any of the billion miles of beaches in the US. I reject the notion that much of anything that could be done overseas could not be just as easily done in pretty much any field anywhere in the US. I was glad to see them go to Canada. [B]I have yet to figure out why they send the Challenges overseas and not TRW.[/B][/QUOTE]
It might be to avoid spoilers (too bad they can't stop Vevmo :D). They probably don't want to be filming an elimination in California and some random bystanders witness someone being eliminated. Idk, it's just my guess.
And what about Real World: London, Paris, and Sydney (Cancun wasn't technically overseas.)
[QUOTE=SeanDaniel;221267]CastAStone, there are lots of ways they could do that and still be interesting--kayak racing in the New River Gorge; cross country/repelling in WV; some sort of relay along the Appalachian Trial; anything along any of the billion miles of beaches in the US. I reject the notion that much of anything that could be done overseas could not be just as easily done in pretty much any field anywhere in the US. I was glad to see them go to Canada. I have yet to figure out why they send the Challenges overseas and not TRW.[/QUOTE]
Yeah...I was kidding.
[QUOTE=CastAStone;221264]
As to you Bacchus, I can see it now...
The Challenge: Detroit
Challenge 1: Walk around the Joe Louis Arena area at night and don't get shot.
Challenge 2: Walk around the Cass Corridor at night and don't get shot.
Challenge 3: Road trip to Flint; don't get shot.
etc.[/QUOTE]
First of all, it would be [B][URL="http://www.ford.com/"]The Real Ford Challenge: Motor City[/URL].[/B]
Secondly, all the participants would be "armed" with the new Ford Focus EV...
[CENTER][url=http://vevmo.com/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=8267][img]http://vevmo.com/imagehosting/14ce3485f9b69e.jpg[/img][/url][/CENTER]
Which would make quick work of any of the cruft around Joe Louis, as well as being eco-friendly at the same time.
Finally, and most importantly, all cast members would be able to use Focus EV's the state of the art GPS navigation system to take the scenic route via [B]Brighton, Michigan[/B] to Flint...
[CENTER][B][SIZE="5"]"Where quality is a way of life."[/SIZE][/B]
[url=http://vevmo.com/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=8266][img]http://vevmo.com/imagehosting/14ce347d3e229a.jpg[/img][/url]
[SIZE="4"]
[URL="http://www.brightoncity.org/BusinessAndCommunity/VisitorInfo.htm"]Visit us here.[/URL][/SIZE][/CENTER]
Another off the wall suggestion, so long as we're holding it in the US and looking to save some $$$? Live finale, charge admission. I bet we could find 10000 people willing to pay $25, especially if you put it in a city like Buffalo or Topeka that is so overwhelmed with glee when someone national remembers they exist that they sell out everything. That at least covers the prize money. Or do it on a college campus and make the student activities group pay for it like Conan did.
I suppose you could make it so the competitors get their own sponsors like golf and not pay them anything at all unless they win, place, or show, and house them at the Red Roof Inn or in tents. Not sure it would help ratings but would help costs.
I just think it sucks that The Challenge has the possibility of being cancelled while shows like World of Jenks and The Buried Life are barely pulling in 700,000 viewers. I just wish they could work out a budget and renew the contract. This show is pulling in 1,400,000 (that's both of those shows combined).
[QUOTE=RMD1;221962]Isn't 0.8/2 A-18-49 really great and the main focus?[/QUOTE]
Its the main focus, that's true. What it means is that somewhere between 986,250 and 1,117,749 people in that age range watched the show. I assume that most of the other 300k - 400k are younger then that, which makes them also decently valuable.
As to whether that's good, for MTV prime time, yes. For MTV at 10 M-Th over the course of a year, which are the 4 most important hours on its schedule, its not great, not terrible.
[B]Real World Road Rules Challenge[/B]
[B][U]Episode 8[/U][/B]
- 1.053 million viewers
- 0.8/1 HH
- 0.6/2 A18-49
- 1.0/3 W18-34
I'm going to write a children's book called "Taking a completely unnecessary week off for Thanksgiving and the Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad Ratings that it causes".
[QUOTE=CastAStone;224610][B]Real World Road Rules Challenge[/B]
[B][U]Episode 8[/U][/B]
- 1.053 million viewers
- 0.8/1 HH
- 0.6/2 A18-49
- 1.0/3 W18-34
I'm going to write a children's book called "Taking a completely unnecessary week off for Thanksgiving and the Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad Ratings that it causes".[/QUOTE]
[center][url=http://vevmo.com/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=8378][img]http://vevmo.com/imagehosting/15504cf82f0a54ea5.jpg[/img][/url][/center]
Well, let's just enjoy the rest of Cutthroat !! And enjoy all of the next Challenge as well and hope all of our favorite cast members are on it.... because after that the Challenges are probably done IMO.
[QUOTE=CastAStone;224610][B]Real World Road Rules Challenge[/B]
[B][U]Episode 8[/U][/B]
- 1.053 million viewers
- 0.8/1 HH
- 0.6/2 A18-49
- 1.0/3 W18-34
[B]I'm going to write a children's book called "Taking a completely unnecessary week off for Thanksgiving and the Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad Ratings that it causes"[/B].[/QUOTE]
I sure wonder what it'll be about...
Anyhow, the ratings are equal to the show, poor.
[QUOTE=CastAStone;224610][B]Real World Road Rules Challenge[/B]
[B][U]Episode 8[/U][/B]
- 1.053 million viewers
- 0.8/1 HH
- 0.6/2 A18-49
- 1.0/3 W18-34
I'm going to write a children's book called "Taking a completely unnecessary week off for Thanksgiving and the Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad Ratings that it causes".[/QUOTE]
I am absolutely convinced that BMP and MTV were not anticipating a 25% ratings drop to great the return of CT and Tina. I'm guessing that some panic may have set in at 1515 Broadway.
Part of the drop is a general trend on MTV since Jersey Shore ended - the channel has fallen out of the top 25 cable channels and to #7 in the 18-34 demo. They were a top-ten staple in total viewers and top 3 in 18-34 I think every week JS aired this summer/fall. Without the Shore people are forgetting the channel exists again and combined with the declining editing and storytelling on the show we're getting to ratings that would make previous seasons $#!t they should have shown episodes look impressing.
I suspect the Thanksgiving holiday and the end of the semester being upon us attribute to this. Since exams are starting, I suspect that next week's ratings will be even worse.
[QUOTE=RMD1;224624]I don't understand how it went down that much.
I am hoping everyone realized that it was on itunes and downloaded it instead of watching it on MTV :D[/QUOTE]
That's what I did :/
[QUOTE=RMD1;224624]
I am hoping everyone realized that it was on itunes and downloaded it instead of watching it on MTV :D[/QUOTE]
I would have never paid for that.
[QUOTE=CastAStone;224610][B]Real World Road Rules Challenge[/B]
[B][U]Episode 8[/U][/B]
- 1.053 million viewers
- 0.8/1 HH
- 0.6/2 A18-49
- 1.0/3 W18-34
I'm going to write a children's book called "Taking a completely unnecessary week off for Thanksgiving and the Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad Ratings that it causes".[/QUOTE]
LOLZ. Buh-bye
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