[QUOTE=tjhallow;162708]Ok..then I would rank him 4th without knowing CJ's abilities. IMO, it would be Landon, Darrell, Wes, and then Kenny.[/QUOTE]
That's what's great about opinions. That's all they are. :)
I'll take the facts as they are.. when it comes to winning challenges... Kenny is well above Wes. Until we get them in a series of head to head competitions, that's all that can be proven.
[QUOTE=Insider;162709]That's what's great about opinions. That's all they are. :)
I'll take the facts as they are.. when it comes to winning challenges... Kenny is well above Wes. Until we get them in a series of head to head competitions, that's all that can be proven.[/QUOTE]
So Insider you are basing your opinions on how Kenny finishes in the challenges? I mean, that he's present at the end, or that he's on the winning team of a challenge?
Do you still think that Kenny is a better competitor if we are just comparing who does better, individually, in the athletic competitions? Or elimination rounds?
I guess it would be hard to tell in elimination rounds since Kenny would sell his mother to avoid going into one.
[QUOTE=Insider;162709]That's what's great about opinions. That's all they are. :)
I'll take the facts as they are.. when it comes to winning challenges... Kenny is well above Wes. Until we get them in a series of head to head competitions, that's all that can be proven.[/QUOTE]
Well does that mean Kenny is better than someone like CT, who never won a challenge? Challenges aren't just about athleticism. I'm not saying Kenny's worthless, he's far from it..but you get my drift.
And so far Kenny has won more challenges than Landon, does that make him better than Landon?
That's a good point TJ. What I'm saying is that it's all subjective. CT is obviously more muscular and can probably bench more... but Kenny has better wrestling technique and could probably pin CT. Who would win in a sprint? Kenny or CT? It's really too hard to prove who is "most athletic" or exactly what the definition is... All we can do is go by what we know to be fact.. and when it comes to these challenges... that's really all that matters.
Katie Doyal, Sarah Greyson, and Rachel Moyal have all challenges....doesn't make them better than someone who hasn't won one or whatever.
All I'm saying is what gets Kenny far is his social skills, and there isn't anything wrong with that either. He's making bank, but IMO, he's far from the strongest..I'd put him in the middle.
Katie Doyle, Sarah Greyson, and Rachel Moyal have not won almost everything single challenge they've been on. That's not even a comparison.
I know what you're saying. I know what your opinion is. I'm telling you that my opinion is different.. and I'm telling you why.
It takes someone like Wes for me to back Kenny. Kenny may not be as skilled in swimming but he is better in wrestling. We know that. Whoever said that Wes quits when he knows he is going to lose just proves that he isn't as great as everyone thinks. Who just quits? Yes Kenny tries to avoid going into elimination rounds but seriously, who goes "I just loooooove taking a chance of going home. PLEASE send me in!" Really? I think generally, Wes may be better at things then Kenny but that just sometimes. Other times I think they are about the same. Like the rope swing challenge on the Ruins, looked like they did just about the same. Wes couldn't even throw a challenge right. He said his plans were foiled... yes they were foiled cause he couldn't think a little harder. Maybe he could have unclipped himself, gone up higher and unclipped a weaker girl, like maybe Katie. That would have DQd everyone underneath her. He couldn't even think of that. So in terms of likability and who has succeeded the most, it's Kenny > Wes. And as far as Kenny vs CT we know Kenny is a better wrestler so anything normal wrestling like having to pin the opponent down Kenny would probably win because he's trained in it, but it's been proven that CT would beat Kenny in anything else. We know this, it's not even debatable like Kenny vs Wes is.
We could debate Kenny's athletic prowess (or lack thereof, if you take the other side of the argument) til the end of time. So whatever, people have different opinions about what makes someone a good competitor.
I'm more interested in seeing how Kenny's social game goes without his buddies Johnny and Evan there. I did really like Kenny back in the original Fresh Meat season, so I'm hoping that when he's not one of that mob, I'm able to see more of that side of him.
I can't wait to see which alliances are formed or broken in this challenge, particularly as far as Kenny is concerned.
Well I've been at work all day so I'm just coming back to give my take on all of this since we all know what a huge Kenny fan I am. :)
We have rehashed every argument about whether or not we think Kenny is a good physical competitor (and most of you by now know my position on this), as it is a very subjective thing and everyone here seems to have a different definition as to what constitutes an elite competitor. As far as Kenny goes on this particular season, I would put him behind Landon, Wes, and Darrell, and ahead of Danny and Ryan. As many people pointed out, we can't just [I]assume[/I] CJ will be a better physical player, so we can't just rank him where we [I]think[/I] he'll be.
CharR, I made a similar point a few weeks back about Kenny being on a Challenge without Evan and Johnny. This will mark the first time he has not been on a Challenge with either of them, so I think he won't be able to rely on his social game as much, since there seems to be a wider variety of people this time around and not a lot of people who I think will blindly follow him. I think that will be the most interesting thing on this Challenge, seeing how the alliances play out, and I wouldn't be suprised to see Kenny get thrown in an elimination early.
Look everybody, I posted about Kenny and didn't say one negative thing about him!
[QUOTE=AJHill;162789]Well I've been at work all day so I'm just coming back to give my take on all of this since we all know what a huge Kenny fan I am. :)
We have rehashed every argument about whether or not we think Kenny is a good physical competitor (and most of you by now know my position on this), as it is a very subjective thing and everyone here seems to have a different definition as to what constitutes an elite competitor. As far as Kenny goes on this particular season, I would put him behind Landon, Wes, and Darrell, and ahead of Danny and Ryan. As many people pointed out, we can't just [I]assume[/I] CJ will be a better physical player, so we can't just rank him where we [I]think[/I] he'll be.
CharR, I made a similar point a few weeks back about Kenny being on a Challenge without Evan and Johnny. This will mark the first time he has not been on a Challenge with either of them, so I think he won't be able to rely on his social game as much, since there seems to be a wider variety of people this time around and not a lot of people who I think will blindly follow him. I think that will be the most interesting thing on this Challenge, seeing how the alliances play out, and I wouldn't be suprised to see Kenny get thrown in an elimination early.
Look everybody, I posted about Kenny and didn't say one negative thing about him![/QUOTE]
He still is in a great position as far as social game goes. Paula is there, and Sarah. And its obvious Darrell wont side with Wes. I know thats only 2 people, but I think Kenny is generally better liked by fellow cast mates than Wes. I think Kenny is still in a good social position
I to know his athlethic perfomance is subjective and sure he should be ranked higher but then you have situations in which he loses to medicore competitors (Nehemiah). Sure he is clutch in final missions but some people have never made a final mission so that also could speculative how well they would do in finale as well. One thing I do know is I would definately like to see Danny face-off agianst Kenny because I think he actually could beat him in a single one-on-one competition.
[QUOTE=mr.unamazing;162835]I to know his athlethic perfomance is subjective and sure he should be ranked higher but then you have situations in which he loses to medicore competitors (Nehemiah). Sure he is clutch in final missions but some people have never made a final mission so that also could speculative how well they would do in finale as well. One thing I do know is I would definately like to see Danny face-off agianst Kenny because I think he actually could beat him in a single one-on-one competition.[/QUOTE]
I still dont see what is so bad about losing to Nehemiah. The guy flew up that rope, he could have beaten a lot of people in that elimination. Plus Nehemiah has only lost to Eric (in an elimination that was nearly impossible for Eric to lose) and Evan.
And about Danny, I think just about anyone could beat Danny. He puts way too much pressure on himself whether it be for his mom or for melinda. I dont think Kenny would have any problem with Danny.
[QUOTE=dplayer18;162859]I think Kenny would definitely be able to take Danny. Kenny has proven himself way more...[/QUOTE]
Please. I could take Danny in anything that wasn't influenced by weight. And I'm a girl. The fact that he could take Danny says nothing.
True that I definitely don't see Darrell siding with Wes, just not sure he would side with Kenny either. Or at least, if Kenny is in that group, he's likely not to be controlling it. And Darrell would probably keep Landon, and maybe Jillian over Kenny so Kenny would have to rely on himself to get to the end, not his alliance. Interesting dynamics.
I miss when Kenny and Wes were on the same side.
I want to see Danny take on Kenny because I personnally am under the belief that past laurels really don't matter from challenge to challenge because each challenge has so many different factors. (people, team set-up) With Danny being bigger then Kenny you would think in theory he could beat him considering the last time Danny went into an elimination he faired pretty well agianst a man who has NEVER lost an elimination.
From a "competitor" standpoint Kenny is borderline pathetic for a male on these shows. That is however taken from the context of what many people would think when told to define that word. Meaning athleticism/skill/coordination or something along those lines.
I unfortunately can not give screenshots but I'll do my best to describe what is shown and anyone here can just look up the video on mtv.com. Here are some examples
Duel 1:
1. Rollar derby - guy was terrible, showed almost no coordination whatsoever. And for any doubters go watch Aneesa's aftershow she pretty much explains what I am trying to.
2. Rope elimination - went slow as hell against Nehemiah, go watch Evan/Ct they were up that thing in a couple seconds. Kenny looked awkward as hell going up and was a good 5-10 sec behind Nehemiah.
Inferno 3:
Can't really say much about this challenge cause the videos don't work, but I remember Abe saying, "I don't think either of these *****es are going to win the life shield, have you seen them at the challenges? They suck!" referring to Ace and Kenny. And for the most part Abe is right.
Gauntlet 3:
sidenote: this is when the real ************* started, must of been a combination of winning a challenge/being a veteran who the **** knows but this was where it all started. I mean the challenges at this point became a joke, Ace making it to the end, Derrick winning, Fresh meat taking over, it just seemed like everything became too easy once I3 rolled up.
1. First challenge - Kenny is out first round for his team, the other one being Casey
2. Finale - if you watch when the swimmers arrive on land, the first one is Evan, then a group of Brad/Frank/Evelyn then later your shown a snapshot of the last few arriving which included Kenny and Rachel. Everyone else already being on land of course.
There are most likely more examples but I really can't stand going to look up every challenge because of the commercials and whatnot but I think we all get the point.
Basically to summarize, Kenny's prowess as an athletic threat should be nonexistant. He has a lot of friends and that is well known but his movements are sluggish, he has shown no ability to be a fast climber/runner/swimmer, he should be categorized as a solid won't hurt the team kind of player, no where near Landon/Ct/Alton and the Miz/Evan territories. As far as his archrival is concerned, I would take Wes over him by a little but we all know the challenges now a days are not about making the best team because they have figured out it doesn't really matter.
Honestly, I have always thought of Kenny as pretty much athletically useless as well, and I'm not a Kenny fan, at all. BUT, re-watched Inferno 3 recently... I think Kenny is only useless when it doesn't really matter to him if he does well. When his *** is on the line, and say, he needs to win a life shield, he's pretty good. He actually wakes up and tries pretty hard. It confirmed what else I've always said about Kenny though... he'd sell his own mother to avoid going into an elimination round. Kenny likes to take the easy road, cruise through to the end. He does NOT want to have to fight for his place there one on one.
That being said, he want into Exile a lot on FM1.. of course he was brand new and had Tina for a partner so that was ineviteble. I'm interested to see if he goes into any exiles, or how many exiles on FM2. And what moves he pulls to stay out of them.
Staying out of elimination rounds isn't exactly bad and easy. Kenny had to fight the other guys on his team to win those 2 life shields. He had to prove that he was worth more then Danny and Adam on G3. He had to work hard at his alliances and as hard as the other guys on his team to win almost every mission on the Ruins. The island is a different story. On the Duel, he still didn't know how things worked and even still, I don't think he'd make it to the end unless his alliance did well like Evan's did but even then, the other guys (except maybe Johnny) in his alliances are stronger then he is.
My summary of Kenny's abilities: Stupid, strong, and lazy as all hell. He has friends in both high (Evan) and low (Bananas) places to do the gruntwork.
Kenny must be a huge idiot if he can manipulate others to do his work. But if that makes him stupid, what does it make other people? Kenny is no top contender, there's no arguing that, but he does what he has to do to win and he should keep it up. He's doing a hell of a lot better then other people like Wes.
I have gotten word that Kenny is going to officially going to retire from the Challenges!
[via] in our wildest DREAMS!
who are am I kidding that's like laying him off of his job.
For the person who pointed out Kenny's negatives in challenges, you can do that for anyone, everyone has challenges where they lose or mess up. As for the rope thing you don't know for a fact how slow he climbed the rope because from what I remember there's no time stated and anything can be edited to look differently than how it actually was.
And I'm pretty sure this has been stated before but whether you love or hate Kenny, he's entertainment and having him on the challenge does boost ratings because he says stupid things and does crazy **** and that's what people want to see.
As for athleticism you can't definitively say he's stronger or weaker than someone based on eliminations alone because we've seen stronger competitors lose to weaker ones, sometimes things just don't work out perfectly.
My opinion on Kenny: Hilarious! As a competitor I think he plays a very smart game by flying under the radar and making good connections with people. I think he does this on purpose because it works for him. The game hasn't been structured in a way that he couldn't do this since the last FM. I'm so interested to see if he will rock FMII. I think he will because when it comes down to saving his own butt, he puts in 150% athletically and he has ALWAYS rocked the mental part of the game!
While I do think there are stronger physical competitors in this, LANDON, I think Kenny's combo of the mental AND physical game just might secure him the win.
[QUOTE=AMGerl;165571]My opinion on Kenny: Hilarious! [B]As a competitor I think he plays a very smart game by flying under the radar[/B] and making good connections with people. I think he does this on purpose because it works for him. The game hasn't been structured in a way that he couldn't do this since the last FM. I'm so interested to see if he will rock FMII. I think he will because when it comes down to saving his own butt, he puts in 150% athletically and he has ALWAYS rocked the mental part of the game!
While I do think there are stronger physical competitors in this, LANDON, I think Kenny's combo of the mental AND physical game just might secure him the win.[/QUOTE]
Flies under the radar? Are you [I]serious[/I]? If that man is considered incognito I shudder to think of what you call conspicuous.
Also it's not as though he's a nice guy using his charm to barely eek through, he's very much so a bully and despot on these challenges. Lastly, while I can certainly appreciate the hyperbole it is no humanly possible to give "150% athletically", but that's not to say he's not a good athlete.
While I respect his ability to continually perform above average physically, he's a textbook Common Sociopath.
[QUOTE=Insider;165596]I think sociopath might be a stretch. He's really not that bad.[/QUOTE]
Look up Psycopathy and Sociopathy in the DSM-IV. Sociopathy is a DPD and is usually measured against these criteria: Callous unconcern for the feelings of others and lack of the capacity for empathy; Incapacity to maintain enduring relationships; Incapacity to experience guilt and to profit from experience, particularly punishment; and is markedly prone to blame others or to offer plausible rationalizations for the behavior bringing the subject into conflict. There are other qualifiers as well, I just neither have the time nor the inclination to go into them at the moment.
And honestly, if I'm going to spend my time gleaning into the psyche of psycho or sociopaths, there are far more interesting (and less pedestrian) studies than Kenny Santucci.
If you ever get the (dis)pleasure of meeting him in person you can draw your own conclusions. However this is just my amateur analysis as I never did complete my Criminology degree.
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